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I have a Suburban 1500 with towing package. I want to buy a tandem axle (brakes on both axles) trailer to carry my tractor and attachments (max about 7,000 lbs.).
I have read many posts regarding sway bars and a host of other suggestions to improve the handling when pulling a trailer. To be honest, this is somewhat confusing. What do I really need beyond my Suburban and the trailer?
PJ
I have a 16 foot dual axel flatbed trailer that I tow with a ram 3/4 ton. It's rated for 7500 lbs, is a bumper pull, no sway bars. I've had it very heavy and it tows just fine. If your suburban suspension is up to the tongue weight you should be ok without sway bars though I've heard they are beneficial. Important is to make sure the traileer is level (ie not so tongue heavy that the front of the trailer inclines, you get excessive sway in that condition.) Longer trailers will also tow better than shorter ones. Not really sure why though.........
You have a receiver hitch right? Not just a bumper mount ball.
You may not need the swaybars, but might want to go to a load equalizing hitch. I have a 7500# GVW dual axle trailer and don't have either. But I only load it to about 4K and am careful about tongue weght. Converting to an equalizing hitch is about $300 and can be done at any time. I'm not certain, but think the anti sway can also be added later if needed.
If the tongue weight is too high, add the equalizing rig. If it sways, try increasing the tongue weight. If it doesn't help, add a anti sway mount.
And of course a brake controller. A Tekonshia Prodigy is supposed to be good. I have a Drawtite controller and it sucks!
Paul, if you have the trailer brakes and you have the trailer loaded properly; i.e., enough tongue weight to prevent "fishtailing" but not enough to keep the rig from being close to level, you might not need anything else. However, you can add a friction type sway control for about $100 that would definitely make it safer. And if the tongue weight is enough to lower the back end of the Suburban and front end of the trailer, then you might want the lift bars (load distributing hitch). The sway control and the lift bars are two different things.
Spend the $100 and get a sway control - it is WELL worth it. Yes, I've towed without a sway control, but just about refuse to do it now. Cheap insurance - VERY cheap! I commonly tell folks it was the best $100 I ever spent.
It's very simple to hook up - two small hitch ball mounts - one on the trailer, one on the draw bar of your hitch. (See attachment.) Put the sway control between the two, hook it on with the two pins, and tighten it down. That’s it.
Not every trailer tows well, and how it tows will change with the weight on it - and how it is balanced. I've had trailers that towed perfect get squirrely with different weights on them - even when the tongue weight was within spec and adjusted. I don't know anyone who ever regretted putting on a simple friction sway control. If you tow anything big like a travel trailer, they are just about considered mandatory - talk to some full time RV'ers - they'll tell you.
Around Christmas time I saw a $40K Airstream trailer and it's Suburban tow vehicle laying on their side on IH-35 after going down a small (maybe 1%) hill. Trailer started oscillating, swaying from side to side and dumped them both over on their side. If the driver had used his electric brakes he might have been able to prevent the accident - but if he had a sway control on he would have never even been put in the situation to begin with. Nobody hurt, but a $100 for a simple friction type sway control would have saved a LOT of money and heartache - what's the old saying? "Penny wise and pound foolish"?
Weight distributing hitches are used a lot of the time on travel trailers, but for your general use utility trailer, since you can shift the load fore/aft, they are rarely needed. Not a bad thing to have, just that you really probably won’t “need†one unless you plan on having some really heavy tongue weight. (Look to your manual - it will say what your towing specs are with a weight dist. hitch vs. without.)
Make sure you have a good brake controller and I prefer brakes on both axles - not just one (I upgraded from one to two and haven’t regretted it - stopping is a good thing. [img]/forums/images/icons/wink.gif[/img] ) Some may say this is overkill, but hey, just look at it as more cheap insurance (and a stress reducer as well.)
Hope this all helps.
Well said and good advice, Ranchman.
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they are just about considered mandatory
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In my opinion, they should be mandatory on travel trailers, but I've talked with lots of RV owners who wrecked their first RV and said the dealer who sold it to them didn't tell them about sway controls.
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If the driver had used his electric brakes he might have been able to prevent the accident
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That's a little procedure everyone who pulls a trailer with electric brakes should be familiar with. When a trailer starts to sway, oscillate, or fishtail, many novices first instinct is to step on the brake pedal, and that's probably the worst thing they could do. If instead, they'd reach down and apply the trailer brakes with their hand while holding steady on the accelerator pedal, or even increasing pressure very slightly on the accelerator, they'd pull the rig back straight.
Thanks to everyone for their great help on this issue.
Sway bar and brake controller will be added for sure. Initially, my plan is to rent a larger enclosed trailer to move household items to Montana. Then purchase the trailer for hauling the tractor and attachments around town.
PJ
Bird,
Easing on the trailer brakes is something I learned long ago from my Father-In-Law, who was an OTR trucker. If things don't look just right, hit the trailer brakes a bit, straightens ya right out.
Jerry
Thanks Bird. [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]
<font color="blue">...I've talked with lots of RV owners who wrecked their first RV and said the dealer who sold it to them didn't tell them about sway controls. </font color>
Ugh! [img]/forums/images/icons/tongue.gif[/img] I bet (just pure conjecture here) the sales guys are worried about "closing the deal" and squeezing every last penny out of their customers - without having the perception of throwing in a "useless option" (kind of like the $200 undercoating they sell on cars, etc.) Shame on them! [img]/forums/images/icons/mad.gif[/img]
<font color="blue">That's a little procedure... </font color>
Thanks for helping me out on that one - forgot to explain what I meant. [img]/forums/images/icons/blush.gif[/img]
Yea - made me sick to see $70,000+ of vehicle & trailer laying on their sides when $100 would have prevented it. Just glad I didn't see a bunch of hamburger meat along with it! [img]/forums/images/icons/crazy.gif[/img]
Ranchman, I guess most of us have done some really dumb things as a result of ignorance. I know I have at least. [img]/forums/images/icons/frown.gif[/img] I bought my first RV in '71 and my shopping came down to deciding whether to buy a little 17' travel trailer the dealer had or to buy the 10.5' cabover slide-in pickup camper. At the time I had a Plymouth Roadrunner and a 6-cylinder manual transmission Chevy pickup. I would actually have rather had the trailer, but thought the tongue weight was too much for my vehicles, so I traded the pickup for a new 3/4 ton V-8 truck with the slide-in. It was a new dealership, the guy never mentioned load distributing hitches and sway controls, and I had only pulled boats and small utility trailers with bumper hitches. [img]/forums/images/icons/frown.gif[/img] That Roadrunner would have pulled that little trailer very easily, but I was too ignorant at the time to know it. [img]/forums/images/icons/frown.gif[/img]
Ranhman,
I know these are important on travel trailers but around here now one uses one for equipment trailers. Probably not a bad idea but part of the problem with a travel trailer is the fact that its a huge surface are for gusts of wind?
The setup in your photo connects up in addition to the regular tongue ball mount? Do you have a pic of it all hooked up?
The comment about not using the ball mounted bumper is a good one. Look around its not hard to find bumpers that are just slightly bent down....wonder what could cause that? [img]/forums/images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]
Sometimes you will see one with a 2 5/16 10,000lb ball on that thin little bumper [img]/forums/images/icons/shocked.gif[/img] .
Fred
<font color="blue">...but around here now one uses one for equipment trailers. </font color>
Equipment trailers are generally shorter & wider, but they too can definitely start oscillating. Seen it happen often going down the highway - both on "empty" trailers and with something on them. Matter of fact, saw one going back & fourth about a full foot just the other day (lawn equipment service).
Is it as critical on a utility trailer as a travel trailer? No - that is it isn't until you wind up in a ditch unexpectedly. [img]/forums/images/icons/wink.gif[/img]
<font color="blue">...but part of the problem with a travel trailer is the fact that its a huge surface are for gusts of wind? </font color>
Yes, the wind can start the oscillation, but it isn't the only cause. Additionally, think about putting something such as a tractor or other "sail" on it. I can definitely feel the trailer get "sucked" in when an 18 wheeler passes me while hauling my tractor or Jeep on the trailer. It's much worse without the sway control (done it a couple of times - never again [img]/forums/images/icons/shocked.gif[/img] ).
<font color="blue">The setup in your photo connects up in addition to the regular tongue ball mount? Do you have a pic of it all hooked up? </font color>
The pic I posted I got from the web. Next time I hook up my trailer (give me a week or so) I'll take a photo and post it here.
<font color="blue">Sometimes you will see one with a 2 5/16 10,000lb ball on that thin little bumper. </font color>
Yep. Some people do truly stupid things! [img]/forums/images/icons/tongue.gif[/img] Seen more than one idiot going 75 mph down the highway without safety chains too - makes me sick sometimes thinking about what would happen if the trailer jumped the ball.
There are lots of folks who will never put a sway control on their utility trailer and never have an accident - I won't deny that. For $100 though, it is the cheapest insurance I know of.
I towed a car trailer behind my vehicle for many years. The problem of the swaying and eventual loss of control was always in my mind as I drove. Luckily, my setup was extremely stable without any additional sway control. But I always did stay below any posted speed limit by at least 5mph. I did get to notice that there was a greater tendency for the trailer to oscillate back and forth depending on how it was loaded. So I experimented and found the best weight distribution.
If I was to do it again I'd get the sway control. Better safe than sorry.
Rich
<font color="blue"> I did get to notice that there was a greater tendency for the trailer to oscillate back and forth depending on how it was loaded. So I experimented and found the best weight distribution. </font color>
Yep. That's definitely the thing to do as it can make a big difference. I did the same thing found though that although I could get it to a "fairly good" balance point with a given load, I would still get a few white knuckles at times. After I added the sway control I found my knuckles didn't change color and my heart rate seemed to stay constant. [img]/forums/images/icons/wink.gif[/img]
Just curious but how does a weight distributing hitch work? How does it allow an increase in the trailer weight when it's used? Where does the weight distributing hitch distribute the weight to? Seems to me there's only two things in the equation - the tow vehicle or the trailer no matter what kind of hitch you use (?) [img]/forums/images/icons/confused.gif[/img]
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Where does the weight distributing hitch distribute the weight to?
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It distributes the tongue weight of the trailer from the rear wheels of the tow vehicles back to the trailer axle and to the front wheels of the tow vehicle.
And I don't know how to describe it with just the printed word; perhaps someone else can do that better, or if you stop by any RV place that has the hitches, they should be able to show you very quickly how it works. It's really quite simple.
Bird's got it. Instead of focusing all that weight on your rear axle (over stressing it) and loosing traction on your front end (because it is now lighter), the W.D. hitch helps, well, distribute that weight across all tires/axles of the tow vehicle.
(How it works seemed a little counter-intuitive to me at first too.)
I started to write my version of an explanation, but it was such a convoluted mess, I figured it would be easier to pirate someone else's explanation. [img]/forums/images/icons/tongue.gif[/img]
Here's a link that gives a little more explanation.
Another explanation.
Hope this helps.
Thanks! The second explanation you referenced "lit the lightbulb" for me.
Back when US built front wheel drive autos started to hit the market, either GM or Chrysler had an ad on TV that featured one of their vehicles towing a boat on a trailer. The tow vehicle had no rear wheels!. So they either had an equalizing hitch with really tight chains or a ridged connector and no tow ball. I think this was about 20 years back. My memory's not as good as it used to be. But it was a sight.
<font color="blue"> Back when US built front wheel drive autos started to hit the market, either GM or Chrysler had an ad on TV that featured one of their vehicles towing a boat on a trailer. The tow vehicle had no rear wheels!. So they either had an equalizing hitch with really tight chains or a ridged connector and no tow ball. I think this was about 20 years back. My memory's not as good as it used to be. But it was a sight. </font color>
That was an ad for the Chevy Citation. I was in high school back then and worked in a body shop. We had a procedure we called "clipping" where a car was cut across the floor between the doors and through the windshield posts to replace either the front or rear on a bad wreck. Those Citations etc. were the first cars we clipped that you could still drive, not that we did.
I haven't been following this thread closely but a word of caution. A load equalizing hitch is still no substitution for proper load capacity of the tow vehicle. There was a story posted on an RV forum several years ago by a guy who overloaded his light truck and compensated with a load equalizing hitch. The hitch took enough load off the rear axle of the truck that it reduced it's ability to provide lateral stability. He got caught in a curve/crosswind situation and the whole rig became unstable. Ended up flipping over, totalling everything. Fortunately, no one was seriously injured.
So watch those weight limits, read the little sticker on your door jamb and be careful out there [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]
Fellers, ya'll feel free to correct me if I'm mistaken, but I believe that original add was a Reese hitch ad using an Oldsmobile Toronado, 455 cu. in. engine, that was introduced in 1966, while the Citation was not introduced until 1979, and it, too, was once used in some ads for one of the hitch manufacturers.
Bird:
The 66 Tornado was the first front wheel drive production car built by the big three of the time.
Egon
Rob:
Chyrsler introduced unibody in the early sixties. These cars could be split and welded together and were.
Egon
We had a 1966 Toronado when I was a kid. In fact, it was the car I learned to drive in. What a car! My dad was good friends with the dealer and we got to see it before it's official debut. The dealer had it across the street, in a garage, underneath a car cover. Dad was an Olds man and he bought it on the spot.
This was in the days when new car debuts were a big deal. It was forest green. Loved the rolling drum speedometer. Doors were huge and heavy.
It was also one of the first cars (I think) that had flow through ventilation. Word was that some people saw the dash vents and assumed the car had air conditioning. Ours didn't. There used to be a drag car that had a 455 in the trunk as well as the one up front. Sigh. Those were the days.
Bird
I really don't think it was that early. And I remember it being a car add rather than a hitch ad. Although it could have been. I would like to see it again though.
You may be right, Gary. I didn't get into RVing until the summer of '71 and the only thing I'm really sure of is that I saw an ad with the Olds Toronado and travel trailer with the rear wheels off the car.
Well it doesn't really matter, but I would say the the rear wheels weren' carrying any load!
Bird,
You're right on the money on the models in the ads. The 66 model Toronado was introduced in the fall of 1965 and the 80 model Citation was introduced very, very early in 1979 (around March or April, I believe).
Trailer are now a days very user friendly to operate . In old days you just can control them but now a days its very easy to get the fixed & unfixed, you need to be pretty sure about the load you will try to put on. Else very good advice given regarding trailer above