This topic sort of popped up in the Attachments forum, of all places, over on TBN, so I thought I'd give it a more proper home here. I apologize for how incredibly wordy I get here, but it's been a while since I've had time to do a real post.
I mentioned in passing that I had recently acquired a new caretaker for my Sierra foothills property, and the questions and comments soon began. Here's my situation --
Although I live in the San Francisco East Bay Area, I own 42 acres in the country, about a 2-1/2 hour drive away. It was my parents' retirement place, but now that they are gone, it has been passed onto me. I have always loved the place, but living there is not in the cards for the immediate future. Reasons for that spawned another thread on TBN a couple of years ago, but let's move on to the caretaker thing for now.
Because of the distance, my family and I only make it to the property a couple of weekends a month. When we're there, all I do is maintenance chores. That's not such a bad thing 'cuz it was the justification for me buying a tractor with my wife's blessing. [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img] Even with the tractor though, I've been losing ground in terms of keeping up the place. It's all I can do to maintain control over the weeds, brush, tree limbs 'n' such just to meet fire safety regulations. The pond, well system, fences, decks, etc. have been neglected for years and I just don't have the bandwidth to stay on top of them. There is also the issue of just plain keeping an eye on the place. There's too much there (including a fabulous wood shop, plus Mom's dog and cat) to just leave abandoned for weeks at a time.
Solution -- an on-site caretaker. We had previously built out my dad's former tractor barn and converted it to a little 2-bedroom house when it became necessary to hire someone to take care of Mom in her final years. Mom had refused to allow anybody to live her own house, so having a second one just a hundred feet away seemed like a logical solution. It was several years later when I acquired my tractor and realized the irony of what we had done. Oh well, the tractor fits in the wood shop okay. [img]/forums/images/icons/wink.gif[/img]
The lady who served my mom so well for nearly 5 years was unfortunately not qualified to meet our needs after Mom passed away last year, so we had to let her go and search for the "right" person for the job. We advertised for a live-in handyman on a "work for rent" basis. The more they could do, the less the rent would be. Amazing how many offers we got from people who just wanted to live there and pay full rent. Of those who were actually handy, most had full-time jobs and wouldn't be around very much. We were hoping for maybe a newly retired couple where at least one of them would be home to look after the pets during the day.
Anyway, we lucked out big time with a young fella who runs his own tree care and landscaping service. His dad was a carpenter, and he himself spent time working for a plumbing contractor. Add to that the fact that he was raised with orange tractors, owns, operates and repairs all of his own equipment, and I'd say we hit the jackpot.
On top of everything else, his wife works the evening shift at the local casino (I didn't even realize we had one), so she is home most of the day, and she loves animals. We now have somebody on the property about 22 hours a day.
We paid for a full background check and they both came back squeaky clean. Turns out the casino runs heavy-duty background checks themselves every six months on their employees. The wife I mentioned is a high-level cashier and has to maintain the highest rating in order to keep her job. This couple is also very active and respected in their church. Does it get any better than that?
On the job just three weeks now, and on the trip up there this last weekend, I found the area around the caretaker's house half lanscaped -- prepped for a lawn, veggie garden, new deck railings and external automated light fixtures installed. Several trees had been removed to make way for a sort of yard beautification project. All of this was pre-approved by me. I just didn't expect to see it happen so fast.
Oh -- I forgot to mention that he also did all of the inside prep I was planning on doing before they moved in. Patched all holes in the wall left by the previous caretaker (she loved to hang stuff on the walls), fresh coat of paint on all walls, ceiling and trim, relocated ceiling fan and installed a new light fixture.
The pond is pretty dried out right now, so he was also able to replace the rotting support posts for the dock with fine new pressure treated timbers. Set 'em real nice in concrete, too.
I found a good portion of the dog fence had been replaced, including a brand new gate built from scratch. The garden shed had been nicely cleaned out and new lights and outlets installed so he could set up his own little shop (part of our agreement). Enough for the first three weeks? There's more.
My dad had left some gardening equipment, but none of it had been touched for the last 12 years. I figured anything with a motor on it was a lost cause at this point, but NOOOOOOOOOOOOO! The new caretaker had rebuilt the engine on the portable water pump and the small chipper/shredder. I heard them run for the first time in my life. (Side note -- the chipper that I thought was useless is considerably more efficient than I gave it credit for.)
The guy sounded apologetic that he hadn't gotten the rototiller running yet. He has his own, so he was hoping it was okay to get to it later. I told him it was okay.
In the mean time, his wife had cleaned the inside of the main house, including shampooing the carpets (more than we had bargained for).
THREE WEEKS!!! They are living there rent and utility free, but I think we are getting the best end of the deal.
The question I am putting out to y'all (if you've read this far) is what kind of arrangements and/or experiences have you had with property caretakers? I'm obviously very happy so far, but we're just starting. Any tips or warnings would be greatly appreciated.
Sounds like you got a great deal going there. I have had renters who were supposed to just mow the yard and instead they took the riding mower apart and did not mow and wrecked the house to boot.
Needless to say I sold the house and now have some great neighbors.
I am sure that they can not keep the pace up that they are at, but will keep everyting up just fine for you.
Looks like you have a really good arrangement with your new caretakers. It sounds like they are industrious, clean, motivated and honest. As long as they are happy and you are happy and they meet or exceed your expectations there is not much more you could ask for. You know how the saying goes - "Good help is hard to find." If they continue to work out as well as they have the first three weeks then it looks like you have a win/win situation. Good luck!
Boy Harv, it is hard to imagination how you could have done better. Sounds like a young hard working honest couple getting started and that is pretty hard to find these days. Looks to me like they feel lucky to have found such a nice place to live, so you are helping them out. They are taking pride in the place and already doing some extras to dress things up. It just doesn't get much better. You might actually get to go and relax on you weekend trips. Can you handle that?
My only practical question is whether you have looked into any insurance issues that might reflect on your liabilities at the property with people living there.
Sounds like you got lucky Harv...like others said, I'd be willing to bet the pace of work slows down to a more manageable pace, but that sounds like it will still be a good deal...
I have seen just the opposite scenarios with caretakers for remote properties. We don't own one, but know a few people that do, and have heard horror stories about caretakers moving in (these were not supposed to be live-in caretakers, they were just supposed to take care of the place!), allowing friends and family to move in or use the place as a flop house and even have heard of the caretaker, renting out the places to vacationers and keeping the money!
SOunds like you should count yourself lucky...did you say they are staying for free? Wether they are or not, I'd be careful about having some sort of legal agreement and/or lease worked out in the unfortunate case where the arrangement becomes less beneficial for you. I know in some states its nearly impossible to get renters out of a place.
Sounds great, Harv - a live-in handy man and potentially your own Kubota tech [img]/forums/images/icons/wink.gif[/img] .
I have some questions about the arrangement - if you don't mind...
How do you determine the value of the work performed in order to offset the rental fee? It sounds to me that what they have done already has covered their rent. But maybe to you it's worth 1 month while to them they may already be considering some of the work "bankable" for next month.
What about utilites? Are you covering the heating and electricity? I know that my power tools take a considerable amount of juice - but the work is for me and figures into the amount of money I'm saving by doing it myself. If someone was paying for another's electricity, their DIY projects may turn into a sideline of DIFSE projects (do it for someone else).
You've made it clear that you are very happy with their performance to date, and I don't want to take anything away from what sounds like a very nice couple.
I hope it continues to work as well as you've described.
Well Harv it sounds like you are both winners on this one. Not trying to "one up" anyone here but a number of years ago my wife and I bought a "retirement" (we thought) farm in Prince Edward Island, Canada. We live in Ontario, about 22 hours away, so we looked for a tennant to live in the house while we were not there. Our first call was from a woman who wanted to live there free "because there were people around who called her husband to break in to rural homes that were empty and she didn't want that to happen to us". I believe she was both serious and stupid!!
The next call was from a retired minister and his wife who wanted to move to the country and had once been to a Bible Study meeting at our "new" place. Turns out we "rented" to him at a very low rate to cover taxes and he was the "tennant from HEAVEN". We found out after setting up the rental agreement that he had spent 25 years building and renovating houses before becoming a minister and he loved to putter with his $30,000 worth of tools etc. in his shop. A couple of examples of how well this worked - he called about a week after moving in and said he would really like to put doors on the bathrooms (we had bought the place unfinished from folks who moved out west) and all he could find were old solid wood doors with brass hardware - at least that was all he could find for FREE - and would we mind if he put them on. After thinking for about a millisecoind we agreed.
A couple of years after that he sent us a letter with a bill for furnace repairs. He had come home from visiting his daughter and the house was cold. He called the furnace repair person, had the furnace fixed, negotiated a better price 'cause he thought the bill was too high, paid the bill and asked us to send him a cheque when we had a chance.
We stayed in the house with these folks whenever we visited the Island, shared meals (Wilma made a great ruhbarb custard pie) and stories. These wonderful folks have both passed away and we have sold that property but, your post brough back many heart warming memories of what is possible when people treat each other the way they want to be treated.
I hope your new caretaker is with you for a long, long time.
Harv,
Great success story.
The last five years in preparation for retirement I accepted a position at our World Headquarters, which meant higher pay but also a different city. We have always wanted to retire on our Montana property so we elected to try and find the right people to rent our home while we were in Minnesota for the five years. We contacted five professional rental agencies and interviewed each one. One of the top agencies on our list contacted us 1 week after our initial contact and said they had a couple who were looking for a large place to rent. I flew back to Montana and my wife and I interviewed them and was impressed. Now it is coming up on five years and they have kept up the property and done all the maintenance without asking. We left most of our furniture in one section of the basement and on each visit everything has been perfect.
After hearing about others and their problems with renters I can only say that so far it has been very pleasant.
I do recommend that one use a professional rental agency as they collect the rent, place into proper accounts and cover maintenance as needed.
PJ
Mark -
<font color="blue">You might actually get to go and relax on you weekend trips. Can you handle that?</font color>
Don't laugh! I'm having to completely re-think my agenda when we go up now. My immediate thought is to spend more time with the kids 'cuz they've been complaining that all I do is work and there's nothing for them to do. I see a lot of fishing, hiking, gold panning, etc. in our future.
Reminds me -- the new caretaker loves to fish and is anxious to clean up the pond and hopes I'll let him stock it with fish other than the bass and catfish that seem to naturally live there. Told him I'd think about it (as if I couldn't wait myself). [img]/forums/images/icons/wink.gif[/img]
<font color="blue">My only practical question is whether you have looked into any insurance issues</font color>
Boy, howdy!!! This couple has a 2-year old boy, which was almost a deal-breaker for us. What we've now done is we've gotten an umbrella liability policy. We had to meet some requirements, but managed to get $1 million worth of coverage for $250 a year. We realize it wouldn't be enough if the unthinkable happens, but our agent said it was a reasonable precaution.
We also had them sign a disclaimer whereby they acknowledge that the property has many potential hazards (and we listed a bunch of them) and that they understand and take responsibility for the risks. Never know what could happen if we wind up in court, but figured it might help.
We also required them to install a safety enclosure (we settled on a chain link fence) around their yard for the child, and a few other things we could think of to improve the situation. We paid for the materials -- he did the labor.
Are we still concerned? You bet, but they seem like excellent parents, and they see this as a great opportunity for their child to live in such a beautiful environment. What would you do?
EJB -
<font color="blue">I'd be careful about having some sort of legal agreement and/or lease worked out</font color>
Couldn't agree more. I spent nearly a week hammering out the contracts which covered their fannies as well as ours. As far as the work-for-rent issue goes, the basic agreement is that it my responsibility to maintain prioritized list of things to do, and it is their responsibility to keep records of what they have done.
We wrote up a fairly standard tenant lease agreement which includes a specific rental fee. We also added a clause that all or portions of that fee may be offset by the terms of the caretaker agreement, which is a whole separate contract.
Paul -
<font color="blue">How do you determine the value of the work performed </font color>
The caretaker writes up a contract for each chore (his idea), as if it were one of his regular jobs (remember, he has his own business). When/if I agree to the terms, the value he bids is applied towards the rent. We kinda do these in batches so we can both stay ahead of the game.
Should I feel that I'm not getting my money's worth, or he feels that I'm asking too much, the contract states that a neutral arbitrator, agreed upon by both parties, be called in to settle the dispute. I'm actually a pretty lenient guy -- as long as the place is being well looked after and maintained, I ain't gonna complain. He also seems to take great pride in his work, so I think we're off to a good start.
<font color="blue">What about utilites?</font color>
Basically, the contract gives them a utility "allowance" (a pretty generous one, if I say so). If they exceed the allowance, they are liable for the overage. They like that arrangement.
DumbDog -
<font color="blue">I am sure that they can not keep the pace up that they are at</font color>
Remains to be seen. This guy has already built up almost 3 months worth of rental credit which I am obviously very pleased with. Part of the burden is on me to make sure I provide him with a list of things to do, and part of the burden is on him to complete them in a timely fashion (as per the contract). The contract cuts them some slack to allow for the rainy season, illness, injury, etc. They can fall behind a full month due to such circumstances, but then an attempt to catch up must be made over the ensuing 3 months.
This fella is an admitted hyper-active ball of energy (his wife rolls her eyes and mutters, "you got that right"). I once sent him an email very late at night, and I was surprised the next day to see that he had replied at about 3:30 a.m. Turns out he goes to bed around 8:30 pm and gets up at 3 am, at which time he does his contracts, bids, billing, etc. By 4:30 or 5 am he is usually out on the job, and frequently works until sunset.
I'd forgotten about this bizarre schedule he claimed until this last weekend when we were at the property. I got up at my usual 6 am and started my usual routine. It's still dark around here at that time, and at 6:15 I happened to notice the light was on in the garden shed (actually a nice little building). Figured I or he left it on the night before by mistake. When I went out to turn it off, you guessed it, he was in there installing new outlets and wiring fixtures (part of making it into his shop). Since he was almost done, he must've been out there for at least an hour or two. [img]/forums/images/icons/crazy.gif[/img]
DourBob -
<font color="blue"> I hope your new caretaker is with you for a long, long time.</font color>
Fact is, Bob, it feels like this is just too good to last. These young folks (late twenties) tell me that this is their big chance to save up to buy their very own house. She estimates 5 years, and he thinks it will take longer. Either way, my property is gonna look a whole lot better than it has in recent years. [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]
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