Using old tires for bank retentions??

[DirtPoor]

Some may object for their reasons, however I see thousands of old tires pilling up at recycle yards and know there is a method of using them for erosion contol and retaining walls.

I'm going to be building an access road on my property and where it will go up a steep hill I want to use a terraces of tires, filled with dirt. The plant ground cover in the exposed dirt.

My basic question would be; what are the problems assosiated with this method (in the Pac. NW in particular)? Are there problems with rodents? Do the tire eventually decay and cause soil contamination problems? Etc.

Now, what is the recommended procedure for building a terraced retaining wall with tires? Just lay a course of tires and fill the center with dirt? Should there be any attempt to get dirt into the interior of the tire and how?? (or will that are fill up by it's self or will the sidewalls collapse under the upper pressure??)

I once talked to a fellow who built a house of tires in Arizona but never got any details.

Any thoughts or experiences would be helpful..

Steve [img]/forums/images/icons/tongue.gif[/img]

[phxraptor]

If I were you I would contact the state or county EPA and see if it's legal first. Alot of work if they make you rip it out.

[Handyman]

I made a post a while back about this very subject...
tire thread

I would check with locals to check on codes, but I doubt there would be anything against the use of them since they have been used in public play grounds for yrs and with everyone crying RECYCLE... I think its an excellent idea.

It would be advisible to push the dirt inside the tire as well, maybe adding rocks in the center to help fill.
What gaps you will have will fill themselves in time.
I haven't noticed any additional problems with mice and such, but keep in mind that you garden variety snakes or maybe your cat will keep them in check . I wouldn't worry about the critters though, nature has a way of keeping itself in check. [img]/forums/images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

If I remember correctly, I think tires take like 30 yrs +/- to decompose, a landfills worse nightmare along with plastics. [img]/forums/images/icons/crazy.gif[/img]

[Pat]

Oklahoma can't seem to make sense out of old tires. We are prohibited from having more than XX number of used tires on our property. (I think xx = 25) BUT it is legal to substitute ground up tires in place of washed gravel in septic leach fileds.

Take a look at "rammed earth" which is the typical technique for using tires to build a residence (EarthShip?) By pounding vertically in a tire with a vertically held ram (post or ...) dirt is spread radially into the tires filling the whole thing. Rammed earth recipes often call for dry cement as an ingredient but the top tire or two could be filled with potting soil or whatever. This can be a labor intensive process but just filing with lose soil is not structurally sound. I had a scheme for filing stacks of tires with concrete letting the tires be the forms but I talked with a lisc landfill operator knowledgeable about the laws and I gave it up. I wanted to place the stacks in a curve with the convex side toward the pond forming a horizontal arch and dumping clay on the upstream side. The result was to be a dam with much less dirt than for a typical dam. Oh well.

I think you have received excellent advice re checking the legal aspects.


[img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img] Pat [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

[GaryM]

Pat, regarding the rammed earth in the tires. That's probably an excellant idea. I remember watching a show on PBS maybe 15 years ago about rammed earth houses. The fellow there was using a pneumatic driven power rammer. Looked as though it had a head about 4-5" in diameter.

A tool like that would make it a lot easier to fill and ram the tires. If it uses a lot of air you might need a bigger compressor than most of us have. There are several rammers listed on eBay, but the first ones I saw were all too big to use inside tires. And they were all gasoline powered besides.

[Pat]

There is a gasoline engine powered "pogo stick" packer that might "git 'er done." Was the rammed earth example to which you refer perhaps an "Earthship" in New Mexico? That was the largest single "comunity" of earth packed tire homes I know about.

[img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img] Pat [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

[GaryM]

Morning Pat!

The rammers I saw on my quick trip the eBay were gas engine powered and looked to have compacter plates about 8x8" or so.

The one I had seen on the TV show were about 3-4" in dia and maybe 6' tall. They were using it down inside the wall forms. The ones I saw on eBay would not have fit down there at all.

This fellow was building one home. It may have been the start of the project you mentioned. Kind of a hazy memory. Just popped up after you mentioned ramming the earth into the tires.

[DirtPoor]

Thanks for all of the responses.

I just did another Google search for info and was about to concluded that the topic is dominated by the rammed earth/structural metods used in elevated wall structures.

However, I did find the most useful retaining structure information on a Texas site (TNRCC) at http://www.tnrcc.state.tx.us/permitt...s/retstruc.pdf

Although it doesn't give much technical information it provides enough general information for my needs.

They do mention the use of "geotextile sheet" between the layer of tire to anchor the wall and minimize lateral movement. Just what is "geotextile sheet"? It it like the material I'm required to use for "silt barrier" when I'm excavating up hill from a stream or body of water??

Is it a synthetic fabric ??? Where do I get it???


Steve

[GaryM]

Here in Missouri some folks refer to it as "road cloth" because they put it down on driveways before dumping the crushed rock. It keeps the rock from disapearing into the mud. But it allows water to pass through.

I'm told it can be obtained from quarrys but don't know that for a fact.

[Weogo]

Hi DP,

Here's a link to a house built with tires.
It is a code-approved home, I've been in it and it is very comfortable.
Hopefully the owners will soon update their website now that the house has been completed.

http://home.mindspring.com/~gfstone/id4.html

Dirt was 'rammed' into the sidewalls and the central cavity with a sledge hammer.

I think this would be an excellent way to stabilize your road grade.
Using just soil, you can plant in the tires and have a nice looking retaining wall.

Good health, Weogo Reed