A different idea for a shop

[roypat2126]

LOL!!! Nawww, Pat that ol' thing up there ain't for crows. Itsfur skunks!! [img]/forums/images/icons/wink.gif[/img] Its an amonia gun. Once they smell and get a taste of amonia, they give up on sharin' their odiferousness and just run off!!! The scary thing up there is an improvement plan for the neighborhood but it fell through from a lack of interest. (I actually ran a skunk family out of my old barn using amonia in a water gun....)

Here's another look at my current project. Say, it looked fairly good before the wind/rain! [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

the rafter overhang above the garage doors doesn't have the proper top plate /birds mouth construction atop the wall (thanks to my professional framers) so my challenge if I chose to take it is reworking um. Completed the other side (porch) easily from outside as there was no overhang and the sheathing didn't come all way to end of rafters, but this side is best reached from inside with the ol' sawzall.

I started out planning to site build my trusses using plan from (Barnplans.com) but the construction expense with 2x8s and 1/2" plywood gussets led me to purchase prebuilt trusses. They have a 3-12 pitch lower cord which gives nice cathedrel affect to the ceiling. Peak is about 11'-6". It opens the 26x50 loft room a bit.

The 30x40 barn in back ground will be torn down, reusing some material in the new.

Have a blessed OK day, Pat.
Roy

[roypat2126]

[roypat2126]

Oops!

[Handyman]

[img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img] Guys I want to thank you for all your responses !!!

1680 views and 80 responses (posts) [img]/forums/images/icons/ooo.gif[/img]

Of course the topic has kind of drifted to overhead doors and lighting, but it all falls under different ideas for a shop and I like this [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

I have another question ..?

What about a cathideral type dormer in the center of the roof ?

What I am discribing is lets say a 4' x 4' ( maybe smaller ) open dormer that will be open to the outside... Like a bell tower, but designed not to let the rain in.

Now a exhaust fan could be used or just let physics do its thing.. heat rises right ?

Now.... at the base of this structure... inside the shop, make and install a pivoting metal flap to seal off the winter weather, like a large damper that could be controlled with a pair or small chain or ropes ???

Now think... you would have a place to put your weather vain as well, on top of the dormer [img]/forums/images/icons/wink.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

[Pat]

Handy, I think you may be trying to describe a cupola which I was going to recommend. I don't think you need manual controls for the venting. Consider a 4 sided box with a roof over it with decent overhang. Each of the walls contains a vent with cover(s) that can only open outward. Any facing into the prevailing wind will be held closed by that wind but any on the downwind side(s) will be sucked open by the negative pressure. The structure's hot air will have risen and be waiting at the top to be drawn off when ever there is a breeze.

If you get into the engineering of the vents a bit, you can design them to be partially balanced like the elevator of a light plane. In addition to this partial balance, you design the louver/flap to normally hang partially open. Light rain in the absence of wind will run off the steep slope of the louver. If there is enough wind to worry about precipitation getting inside, the louver will be blown shut on the upwind side and open on the downwind side(s.)

By having the louvers hang slightly open in a no wind condition you allow hot air to escape through the "chimney" effect.

A good sized cupola will not only ventilate the structure well it will add something positive to the looks of the structure. Turbine vents work OK but are butt ugly, especially when compared to a cupola.

If a cupola is installed (or any other roof penetration), you need to pay attention to the flashing detail
I would recommend "gable end vents" at both ends. These could be disguised as "hay mow" doors and lend authentic looking decoration but offer additional practical ventilation. If desired, either or both could be operable doors as well as vents.

Clerestory windows facing the north side offer additional FREE lighting with much less chance of damage from hail or leaking than skylights. They would give a lot of natural light withoug heat gain as there is no direct solar gain from this source. They can be made operable and serve as vents too, but not easily automated, easily remoted, but not automated.

I suppose my "SECRET" is out now... I like natural daylight in my buildings but without traditional skylights. If there are any dark corners left after construction, stick in some solar tubes.

I can't easily tell just how close the trees are to the building but would be concerned as regards roots vs the foundation and leaves and limbs vs roof and gutters (if any.) If you don't have a good grade slope away from the walls past the dripline and well away from the structure then in the long run the building would profit from gutters. Preemptive limb pruning of limbs that are likely to cause problems later would be far better than waiting till there is a problem to prune away. This will let the tree expend its energy on limbs that won't be cut off and it will grow better and be more healthy.

[img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img] Pat [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

[roypat2126]

I agree Handy, what you described sounds like a cupola, Pat mentioned. It's a really good way to vent the building and good place to hang a weather vane as well. There are several places on web for prefab cupolas and some may have the vent louvers as Pat describes, unless you're set on shaping the air-foil louvers yourself! Could turn into quite a project [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

"I can't easily tell just how close the trees are to the building"

There's probably 20-25 ft between barn and trees, can park two large vehicles side by and still plenty room. These are maple species that don't grow extreemly fast so I expect worse case will be leaves in the fall. Will be several decades before the branches venture close enough for pruning. (we have some pruning going on as we speak ....the plum trees are ripening and we have yet to harvest them) Anyhow, out here we let the wind carry the leaves where ever.

I have more problems with the white pine needles in the house gutters then with any of the other tree leaves. (norway and scarlet maple, secamore, tulip poplar, river oak and white oak)

But I plan to install gutters on the shop/barn. I'd like to use a different style of hanger and not use the long gutter spikes. If I'm not mistaken there is a style that fits under the roofing material which seems to me a better way. When stationed in rural England in early 80's I thought the brick houses (cc 1936) looked neat having no exposed down spouts and gutters. Gutters were 'hidden' within the roof edge trim and down spouts formed in the walls were plumbed underground with cleanout traps.

I now sport a nearly complete porch on the barn. I installed angle braces to the posts (mortise and tenon joints at the posts and bolted) and fascia board. Roofing metal delivered yesterday so I should be dry in short order. [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

Have a blessed day,
roy

[Pat]

Roy, Let me gently differ with you for a momemt as regards the "intense design and fabrication" project for the automatic louvers/shutters I mentioned. 'Taint so. Plain louver/flaps of light ga material hanging loosely down by gravity will be held closed by wind on upwind side and will be sucked open by negative pressure on downwind side and are dead simple to build.

If you want to invest a bit of tinker time you can fashion them such that they are slightly open in no wind conditions. When slightly open the overlapping (like fish scales) pieces shed rain that is vertical or nearly so but still allow for rising warm air to get out. If the wind picks up or gusts the side in danger of having rain get in closes under the pressure of the wind.

As regards pruning now... Even though it may be decades before the trees have limbs that annoy you, a little thought now would let you prune the potential problems and not let the tree WASTE decades of resources building limbs to be removed. The resources saved by early pruning will be invested in limbs that you do want.

Built in gutters and downspouts... You sure know how to hurt a guy. Due to my inexperience and lack of receipt of wise council built in downspouts were not thought of untill after it was too late [img]/forums/images/icons/frown.gif[/img] ...AGRGHHH... I am draining downspouts in burried lines and the gutters are such a good match for the trim color they are virtually invisible but still built-ins would be so much neater.

RURAL ENGLAND... Ever get to Petersburrow (sp?) next to last stop on train from London to Portsmouth (last stop.) There is a British Royal Navy installation out in the rural countryside amid thatched roof cottages, narrow stone fence lined lanes, and sheep pasturage. It is H.M.S. Mercury. I spent the day there once getting a progress report and demo from a British contractor who was developing an adjunct to SSIXS (Satellite to Submarine Information eXchange System) a variant of which we sold to the Brits. I was the guy in charge of the US version of that software system and was there for the annual upgrade distribution and training session for their operators who communicated with the Brit's subs.

Please accept my belated thanks to all US taxpayers (and the Brits) who made my travels possible.

[img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img] Pat [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

[roypat2126]

"tain't so."

Hey Pat, your point well recieved. I had vision of Mr. Handy tinkering long hours in his shop with apron, bill-cap, sleeves rolled up, and single bowl-shaped reflector /incandescent lamp overhead, dust in air seen hazily only under the light canopy, and his bench scattered with an array of prototype louvers, metal shavings and clippings pushed back, wood scraps here and there, wire coil bird-nested around heel of the anvil. I like your simplicity of the project.

Pruning trees isn't one of those things I hit with gusto but this fall my plans will include shaping the trees near the barn. I have found my sawzaw does a fairly good job on branches too large for pruning snips, and the bowsaw handles larger ones quite well. And I agree a bit of pre-planning now will produce greater benefit in tree growth later.

Petersborrow (sp) Yes I've been through there couple times and I'm sure it was like my stompin' grounds about an hour west. I saw my first steam powered tractor/plow near Petersborrow (sp). They had the main steam engine stationary on one side of field with one-row plow attachment pulled along with wire rope...was a sight to see.

All my military transactions were at Upper Heyford, but I was based at RAF Little Rissington and surrounding villages were Borton-On-The Water, Fairford, Burford, Swindon only an hour from Welch border. I was part of a site development team to design a military 500 bed contingency hospital. We developed plans for and created site for 1500 beds. It was a three year project but from lack of use (I guess) it took AF stand down around Desert Shield/Storm in early 90's. But The English Cotswolds are The prettiest countryside I've seen.

There is a web site for RAF LIttle Rissington air base, but I've not visited it in couple years. Outside of the eight member site team, the Americans housed there were an extension from RAF Fairford, and the draw down after DS they closed RAFLR and made it a civilan area. So many fond memories there I could write for years. In an old book store in an obscure, quaint village, I purchased a reprint copy of Isaac Waltons' "The Art of Fishing", a real deal for 4 lbs, about $6 US. [img]/forums/images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

I think the atch pic is from this mornings shot. Porch is on west side so it's shadowed but non-the-less an overall shot of the barn.

Have a blessed OK day!! [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]
roy

[roypat2126]

Another shot . [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

[Handyman]

I don't know about you guys.... LOL

Has anyone ever heard of the K.I.S.S method ? [img]/forums/images/icons/tongue.gif[/img]

I was thinking of more of a hood that extends below the top of the edge with wire screen to keep the critters out.
This would easily keep the weather out and allow plenty of ventalation.

Simple clean looking and functional.