Post and Beam barn raising!

[zbadone]

Well, after a delay in putting up my shop I finally got the go ahead from the fianance dept. (wife). I need to keep the cost as minimal as possible.

I have decided on the post and beam construction method. The size I've settled on is a 28x28 with 10ft side walls. It will have T1-11 plywood siding and a metal roof.

A few questions need to be asked first.

I live in Florida, soil condition is sandy, not in a flood zone and well away from the gulf coast. I have the area where the shop will be built cleared.

I'm not sure what size of posts to use, the 4x6 are $21US and the 6x6 are $32US. I would like to space the posts 8 foot on center, with the exception of the one post being 4 foot on center, (28 div 8), makes sense?

Any suggestion as to whch size post to use?

I will need to pour concrete piers using sonotubes with footers, I was thinking 24" deep piers and use the Strong-Ties metal brackets to attach the posts. I've read a few things reguarding premade footer forms made from plastic(?), not sure of the cost? There will be a total of 14 posts.

Could I form these up from wood forms? How would I attach the sonotubes to these forms? I need to pour the footer and the tubes at the same time to prevent cold joints. Rebar will be added as well as J-hooks for the strong-Ties brackets.

What size of tubes should I use? 4x6 post, 8" tube? 6x6 post, 12" tube" Footer size? thickness of footers? Should I add crushed rock to each hole, below the footer since I have sandy soil?

I will be renting a powered hole auger to dig the holes and will trailer in the ready-mix concrete mix myself. Already premixed and ready to pour.

Thanks.

[cowboyjg]

Jeff...The 4x4 posts @ 8' are fine. There are a couple of things I think I would do differently though. First I would bury the post in the ground 3' and encase it in the concrete. Use the 12" sono tube and hold it up from the bottom about 12". You need to make sure the hole is 24" wide this will act as your footing. First drop a 24"x24" hatch of #5 rebar with 3 sticks going in each direction. The stone is not an issue. You can do one of two things, brace the post so it's up off the hatch or you can pour a little concrete and then place the post in. Either way this will allow 1 pour and put the post in the ground where it really should be. Include two verticle lengths of rebar with a rebar ring 3" below the top of the pour. This can be #3 bar (easier to bend). Keep the pour at least 4" abouve grade and taper the concrete at the top of the pour where it meets the post so water drains. (Not knowing your floor situation/plans) The plastic footing forms you were referring to are fine to use also. Remember the rebar though. I prefered buried posts over anchoring with metal. Provides greater stability and a sounder structure.


Good luck with your project.

[roypat2126]

Hey Jeff,
I agree with Most of what Cowboy says. But I would use 6x6 posts as the 4xs have more tendancy to bow/twist then the 6s...assuming you're using treated timbers.

Not sure how you're affected with hurricanes but you might consider also cross-drill bottom end of posts and drive in rebar. Let it hang out 2 or 3 inches giving something like 'ears' for concrete to hold to. Otherwise Gofurit !!!

Have a blessed day, [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]
roy

[zbadone]

I've read many places, that imbedding posts into concrete is not a good thing to do. I was not going to use 4x4 posts, but 4x6.

I am planning on pouring a 8" pier 24" deep, and using the BigFoot slip-on footing system. They run around $20US a piece, delivered to Florida. I only have 14 footers/piers to pour. I will be using the StrongTie brackets to raise the post off the concrete piers.

[roypat2126]

Hey Jeff, I had to reread your original post....and my mistake, yes the 4x6 posts will do just fine. (But I come up with 16 posts for 28x28. Even if set evenly at 7' OC I come up with 16 total posts....unless I am missing something....

Assuming your T1-11 siding will install with vertical grooves, to install full panels (no trimming), place your piers at 27'-5 for the 4" post side and 27'-3" for your 6" post side (provides allowance for the 3/4" T1-11 panel, 3/4" gurts, and the posts thicknesses. (J-bolts center on these demensions) If you want panels to overlap on corners, take 1 1/2" off one dem.

As a suggestion: use 12" auger for your holes, and 8" tubes placed with 4" space at bottom, use 2x2 wood bracing, and pour concrete, giving good one piece footer and pier, not needing crushed rock.

Anyhow, hope this helps.
Have a blessed day, [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]
roy

[zbadone]

Roypat,

You think 8" tubes are sufficent for a polebarn?

This is what I'm about to do, purchase BF-24 bigfoot footing system, these can use 8" to 10" tubes. require a 24" hole.

Lets break post placement down per wall, Load bearing walls (which the rafters will sit on) will have 6x6 posts at corners and at one at 16' from corner post, then a 4x6 on 8' centers.

i.e. load bearing walls:
(6x6) -8'- (4x6) -8'- (6x6) -8'- (4x6) -4'- (6x6)

non-load bearing wall: including the load bearing (6x6) corner posts,
(6x6) -8'- (4x6) -6'- (6x6) -6'- (4x6) -8'- (6x6)

Front wall, which will have a 10' sliding door and a regular door. A single (6x6) at the center of the wall, 14' O.C. as well as (4x6) for ruff opennings at the 10' sliding door and (4x4) for the other half.

Does this make sense? If you draw it out it looks better!

I only will be using 14 Bigfoot footers to carry the building load, and the (4x6) and (4x4) on the front wall will be formed by hand. I like the fact that I can bury the Bigfoot footer and tubes in the ground while I can schedule the concrete pour at a later time. They will be covered till the concrete is poured.

The Bigfoot footer run about $24US for the BF24, but If you think I can use 8" post I can reduce the BF24 to the BF20 and save some money and some concrete.

I was going to use the 10" tubes, a special order since my local building supply house doesn't carry them, just the 8" and 12" tubes.

If I go with the 8" tubes, that only gives me a smaller foot print for my StrongTie brackets, then the 10" tubes. 8"- 5-1/2" (6x6) = 2-1/2" total. I'm not sure of code requirement for pier sizing, here in Florida.

I'll be placing an order for the BF20 of BF24 in the next day or so.

Thanks

Jeff

[roypat2126]

Hey Jeff,
Now that you explained about the (2) posts on front wall I think I'm with you concerning only 14 BF footers. I drew it out as well, and find the 10ft door will have 4x6 set 2ft from the corner and middle posts. The rest of wall will be (from center post, 4ft, 4x4, 3ft door, 4x4, 3ft, 4x4, 4ft, corner post.

My concrete pour for shop floor was 3500PSI with Fiber fill and they said it was the most common used so I 'spect that is what your source will use as well. (3500 or 4000 but your not doing industrial building so 3500 should do fine).

Considering the concrete strength, you should be able to use the 8s although if you feel more comfort with the others by all means do that. But if your building will have gable style roof, and no 2nd floor the 8s will do, as their not supporting a tremendous amount of weight, and when distributed among the 6x6 posts you'll be good to go.

You should check if your county code requirements call for anything specific.

Hope this helps, and you get as much satisfaction as I have with doing a project like this. Be sure to take pics and post um furusta see. [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

Have a blessed day mi amigo,
roy