Table saw

[Pat]

Having had a recent incident involving the table saw and my left thumb (stitches have been out for two weeks) caused in part by working on larger widths of wood when saw fence only opens to 12 inches from blade. ( I couldn't accept full responsibility) I decided to get a larger saw. I did. Lots larger. 52 inch capacity. 3 hp.

Brand: Saw Stop

Supposedly it won't cut you badly.

I was encouraged to go ahead and get it by the CEO (same one who forced me to get cab and air on tractor.)
Now I am committed to making a bunch of cabinets, storage, shelving, furniture etc to save money vs hiring a pro and thus amortize the saw cost. I'm still a little embarrassed at the $ I spent!

Pat (with 9.9 fingers and not wanting to go lower)

[Bird]

I never cease to be amazed at the things some people will do to get the wife's approval to buy something. But cutting off even a small part of a finger seems a bit extreme to me. [img]/forums/images/icons/tongue.gif[/img]

[egon]

It's probably some type of addiction Bird!

Pat's probably due for some type of "Tool Avoidance" association. [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

Egon [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

[Pat]

It isn't negative feedback like in "Clockwork Orange." I worry about certain rules of thumb (unintended but it fits) in psychology, like for instance, "Behavior that is rewarded is repeated."

I hope not to have to demonstrate a need for safety glasses or a hard hat! It could be worse, I'd really hate to demonstrate the need for a protective cup!!!!!

Do not be mislead my friends, do not be lured into "post hoc propter ergo hoc" logical errors. Just because I knew of the saw before I "DID" my thumb is not prima facie evidence that I did it on purpose. Scarier would be if my subconscious, inundated with desire filtering down from the conscious, directed the mishap to attain the goal. That would be cause for extreme nervousness, especially if I were sonambulistic.

I need to do some serious organizing and rearranging to accommodate this sucker as it is fairly large in the 52 inch size. Like most of my other stationary tools/machines, it won't be either. I will be building a dolly on Castor wheels for it. The ones they sell for applications like this are designed to lift the tool the minimum distance they can get by with. I am not comfortable at "standard" tool heights. They are an actual pain in my back so I will raise the saw with a wheeled dolly which will make it easier to manage and more comfortable to use.


Here is a tool test report on several nice table saws. It was published a while back in "Fine Woodworking" magazine. The Saw Stop test results show that it equals or exceeds the precision of every other saw in the lineup in every category.

http://www.sawstop.com/media/W184JOp46-p51.pdf

I guess they are doing what they can to keep from looking even more expensive. The price did not include shipping, a blade of any kind, fence, extension table and on and on. As bad as buying a car and finding out the steering wheel is a separately priced option. Oh, you want lug nuts? They are extra! How about windshield wipers or brake calipers or... You get the idea.

That said, It looks to be a fine saw with excellent fit and finish. It will reduce my wiggle room and easy excuse regarding the quality of my finished product. I won't be able to blame the saw. Like having a gun that easily will shoot MOA, if you don't it isn't the guns fault. Hopefully tomorrow after playing cowboy I will get a chance to make room to uncrate it and set it up.

On the subject of woodworking skills... I am building some built in storage for my wife's Tea Room. I figured three stacks of drawers with four drawers each stack in sizes from the bottom up of 7, 9, 11, 13 inches drawer height. Reality set in. Now I am building in three stacks of three shelves each in 13, 11, and 9 inch heights. I don't know where I went wrong but there is no way for more that the three. Oh well, I'll figure out something to do with three drawers 22x30x7. I can hang them under the work bench or somewhere. Will have to reinforce them a bit if I use them in the shop as that size drawer full of tools will be HEAVY!

Pat

[egon]

Sounds like more excuses to me Pat! [img]/forums/images/icons/blush.gif[/img]

About three or four nice hand saws would do the same work on large panels that the new tool will do. They are also much more adaptive to situational use. Take up little storage space. They are excellent for making tenons and stopped cuts in thick material. There are at least six or so in a toolbox in my basement. They are a tad older than me though but still work very well. [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

In many cases the hand saw will have the job done before you can set up the electric saw. [img]/forums/images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]

Note: It takes real determination to mangle body parts with one of these. [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

Egon

[GaryM]

Good Point Egon!

A hand tool is often faster if it's close by. And stopped cuts always need to be cleaned up with a hand saw, or perhaps a saber saw. Unless that's what you used in the first place.

[Pat]

I have used hand saws more than the average guy. I injured myself a few times when I was quite young but once I learned to start a cut AND keep the hand holding the work farther from the saw so when/if it jumped out of the just started cut you don't get bit, the injury rate went way down.

So Egon, are you trying to have me believe that your method of sawing 4x8 sheet goods is by handsaw? If that were the only reason for a bigger saw I would build a panel saw that could temporarily mount a hand held power saw.

I'm sure there are lots of alternatives when it comes to doing any particular job in woodworking. I'm open to listen to and evaluate alternatives. I listened. I evaluated. I'm not looking for any of my SEVERAL handsaws.

(That's funny, he didn't look Amish.)

I'm sure the drainage ditch you were working on with your tractor could have been worked just fine with a shovel, garden trowel, or even a teaspoon. I noticed you chose a mechanized piece of equipment that with your operating skills and learning ability provided acceptable results in less time with less effort albeit at greater expense (fuel, lubricants, amortization, etc)

Pat (temporarily between rain storms)

[CJDave]

[img]/forums/images/icons/tongue.gif[/img] I've been kind of busy for the last few months, and it's been a while since I posted, but I THINK I can still remember when you still had all of your fingers, Pat. [img]/forums/images/icons/crazy.gif[/img]

[Pat]

Dave, I still have almost all of my fingers. Left index is a little more sharply pointed than the right index due to a chef's knife incident with clumped together garlic powder maybe 20 years ago. Still have and use the same knife with no further incident.

The table saw thing was a definite wake up call, coming on the heels of a local woman with a raised panel door business who cut off two fingers about mid length.

I knew about the Saw Stop table saw and just wasn't motivated to pay that much for a saw since I had NEVER had a table saw injury or close call. I have a significant number of various cabinet and furniture making tasks ahead of me, years of them.

I had discovered through use that my nice little Makita table saw on a stand was a fine saw but way too little for handling sheet goods easily and the fence was WAY TOO LIMITING! The fence will only adjust out to about 13 inches so just adding extension tables or in and out feed tables is not going to be satisfactory.

Shortly after my thumb (smaller, lighter, and with a very different thumb print) healed enough to not require bandages, I went to OKC and bought a Saw Stop cabinet saw. It sat in its crate in the bed of the F-250 inside the garage for a couple weeks. After I finally cleared a space to get the tractor a path to drive it into the shop I finally got to uncrate it and start assembly. There were several separate heavy boxes and the main crate weighted about 700lbs. I muscled the saw off the pallet and used levers and scrap wood to get it up into the air high enough to slide my custom purpose build caster dolly under it.

I wanted to not reduce stability so I made the wheels farther apart than the base dimensions of the cabinet by an amount exceeding the increased height so it should be more stable now than stock (it was like a bolder already.) I wasn't sure if the wood would be stiff enough but figured I could retrofit stiffening if required. It needs stiffening and my temp fix is blocks of wood under the center of the roller stand. It works. The saw's table was 34 inches above the floor, what the company thinks is a GOOD height. I like/need benches and such a little higher to give my back a little slack. The new saw's table is 39 1/2 inches above the floor Thanks to the roller dolly), very comfortable.

It took a while to assemble the saw and check all the adjustments and wire it up for 240VAC power. I got it running last night. I haven't cut wood yet but did run it. It was VERY QUIET just running, remains to be seen how loud it is cutting wood. I need to buy an adapter to let me use my largest shop vac on the 4 inch dust port. Doing much without dust collection is NOT a good idea as the saw is designed for use with dust collection and will not clear the debris well unassisted.

I am favorably impressed with everything about the saw except price but all things considered it is a SUPERIOR saw without consideration of its safety features. Hopefully I will never use the innovative safety feature that stops the blade and drops it below the table and will be happy to continue my life with 9.97 digits (give or take a little.)

I really like the blade guard and it is fast and easy to remove and replace wth the nice riving knife. The rip fence is easy to use, has magnifying lenses above the rulers, and is very stable. The rip fence is adjustable many different ways but came nearly perfect in all adjustments. I used a good square and could not find ANY error in any plane when checking the fence. I used a sharp edged block to try to feel a little error when aligning the fence with the miter attachment grooves. I couldn't. If it was flush at either end then it was flush at both ends and the middle too.

I hope to go to town and get the adapter (while picking up my new computer glasses) and start cutting wood. Like with a precision rifle, if you don't do well with it you are sure the problem is with the person not the equipment. Now my joints better fit because I have no excuse with the equipment.

Pat

[CJDave]

[img]/forums/images/icons/tongue.gif[/img] I first learned of those saws in December of last year. Is that the saw that has some kind of blade disintegrator that activates as soon as it senses flesh? [img]/forums/images/icons/tongue.gif[/img]