Boy I am jealous. I sure would like to have one in .308.
Boy I am jealous. I sure would like to have one in .308.
Jim, If you get serious about the .308 be sure to shop it around. I found the 6.5 Creedmoor in stock for hundreds off the price others asked. Delays from the factory can run into several months so finding a seller with stock can save serious time and $.
I won't knock the .308 but... If you are interested in shooting farther than 3-400 yds you might like the 6.5mm.
The ballistics of the 6.5 are something to consider. The 6.5 shoots flatter than the .308 and it is less effected by wind than the .308 is. The .308 is a really really good round but for some purposes the 6.5 is better. The 6.5 is basically a .308 with a 30 degree shoulder necked to 6.5mm. It has less recoil than the .308 and will group tighter. There is some movement in the 600-1000 yard/meter match shooters toward 6.5mm bullet.
There are a plethora of 6.5 chamberings. The 6.5x284 is a hot number but barrels are reported to start loosing accuracy with as few as 1000 rounds which I find intolerable. The 6.5 Creedmoor was purposely designed to be gentle on brass and barrels and be easy for the hand loader. Even the Hornady factory ammo lists the commonly available powder and weight of charge and uses a commercialy available bullet so you can roll your own if you want. That gives you a safe starting place while looking for the magic combination that will make your rifle sing.
Pat
"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"
UPDATE: I bought a scope and rings. I mounted the scope and rings. I tried to zero the scope and got lousy results. Determined a couple thinigs NOT TO LIKE about the rifle and some that are nice.
Returned scope and got replacement scope promptly. Atually I got the new one before I shipped the old one. Trusting nice to work with folks at SWFA.com real quick and good response via email or phone.
Scope is Burris 6.5-20X50. One shortcoming is that the parallax only adjusts done to 50 yds. I will be putting a short Picatiny rail on top of the forward scope ring to mount a reflex sight for up close 1-50 yds or so shots.
I prefer a short trigger movement before it firms up and I like it to shoot with very little additional motioin once it firms up. The stock trriger had a LOOOOOONG throw. I hold my breath when squeezing off a shot and I nearly got hypoxia squeezing and squeezing and squeezing and squeezing so... I installed a PJ single stage match adjustable trigger. It is soooooooooo much better. Really nice.
Shot a few rounds at 25 yds to get it close and then backed off to 100 yds to fine tune it some. limited time. Next outing I will start at 300 yds and get it where I want it.
Very light recoil due to a few factors. It is gas operated semi-auto, it is a relatively heavy rifle with 24 inch stainless steel bull barrel. and I weigh $250 lbs. I don't think a 90 lb weakling would get "scope eye" with anything over 1 1/2 inch eye relief.
I have larger than standard hands. They look normal on me but at 6'2" and 250lbs what looks in proportion to me is a too tight fit in many XL gloves. Even a smaller person with long (piano player looking) fingers might have the problem I describe next.
The pistol grip is a comfortable fit to my hand but... it is too close to the trigger (for my hand size) and it requires an uncomfortable contortion to get the pad of my trigger finger on the trigger while gripping the pistol grip correctly. If I want the pad of my finger on the trigger mopre naturally and comfortably then I need to use a weird hold on the pistol grip. I have heard there are grips and spacers to solve the problem but haven't nailed down any specific examples yet.
On balance I really like the rifle. It is about at the upper limit of what I can shoot standing off hand due to the weight. I have Harris telescoping swivel bipod installed and that makes prone or table top shooting way less physically demanding.
As soon as I solve the grip to trigger distance problem I will have a very nice rifle indeed.
Egon said earlier, something about taking so long to decide on which weapon the varmint would be gone. How prophetic! This morning a bit before 0630 a big beaver (about 75lbs) crossed one of the back yard dams in plain sight. He was in view about 15-20 seconds or so. My wife wondered why I didn't shoot it.
It would have taken 30 seconds or more to get an appropriate gun and return. (My concealed carry short barrel Glock in .45 ACP is NOT an appropriate weapon for 50 yds. I will be "staging" a rifle in the great room, probably near the rear French doors leading to back porch with good view of the two ponds. I will put it behind a couch near the wall out of sight but with loaded magazine requiring me to only work the bolt and fire.
If the results go well and are not overly embarrassing when I zero the scope for 300 yds, I will post a picture of the target.
Oh, by the way... Funny thing but I have been "haunting" the reloading/sporting goods section on eBay and find that nearly everything of interest to me sells for at least new price and typically a bit more. It is just crazy. I managed to score a few items but in general, since I do not bid over retail, but typically I get out bid. This is a good time to unload any old reloading stuff and similar.
Pat
"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"
Fortunately/unfortunately I will not have problems with a new rifle as there are none in my future. The several I do own will do fine for all my shooting needs.
It's been well over 10 years since I've fired a shot.
With our firearm storage laws everything must be locked up. To this I do comply and on top of all the items are so placed that at the moment it would take at least 1/2 hr. to gain access to all the sundry items. All the bolts, clips and ammunition are stored separate from the firearm.
It's very doubtful that I could hit the inside of a room if I was standing in it so a super accurate firearm is rather a waste using my abilities.
I'm almost thinking custom molded stock Pat! [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img] and double set triggers! [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]
Egon [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]
I'm with you, Egon. When I moved back to town about five and a half years ago, I sold my hunting type guns. I still have the revolvers I carried on duty (as an "honorably retired" law enforcement officer, I could legally carry them in any state, but I don't carry them at all anymore), and I still have two .22 rifles; the Remington bolt action my Dad was hunting with in the early 40s and the Winchester pump I inherited from my aunt (Dad's oldest sister). I do clean and oil them periodically, and even keep the revolvers loaded in the house, but seriously doubt that any of them will be fired again in my lifetime.
Egon, It is really too bad about all the BS that England, Australia, and Canada has imposed on legal gun owners/users. Unfortunately the same idiocy is rampant in the US and sufficient ignorance abounds that there is a clear and present danger that our rights will be infringed ever more egregiously.
One dose of sanity prevailed recently when our supreme court had the intestinal fortitude to rule that the 2nd amendment to the constitution actually says and means what the founding fathers meant and said rather than go through some mumbo jumbo to explain why the right to keep and bear arms is not the right to keep and bear arms.
Double set triggers and other esoterica of that genre are not likely in my future.
I have a few rifles too, my friend, BUT prior to this new one only one of my rifles was not either a pellet gun, BB gun, or .22 cal rimfire. I have a 22-250 varmint gun that is very good to 200 yds and pretty good at 300. Although some folks use the 22-250 for deer, I wouldn't as it is a tad light for a humane sure kill. Yeah, it'll kill a deer or a moose or a Kodiak bear, or an elephant but not surely and humanely.
Well, I do have a couple other rifles in my "collection" but I have never fired these particular ones and mostly have them as nostalgia and collectibles although they are supposedly fully functional. I have an unfired M1 Garand complete with sling, bayonet, cleaning brushes and tools under the butt plate. This Garand is not just not fired by me but has never been fired unless it was fired to test it after assembly. I also have a well worn M1 carbine, a gas operated semi-automatic .30 cal "pop gun" which I have never personally fired. The little carbine is a nostalgia piece for me as that little carbine is what I used in the USAF. I shot expert both left handed and right handed with that little gun and always thought it was an excellent alternative to hand to hand combat and if it jammed up or you were out of ammo it is a wonderful size and weight for an easy to use club. We didn't get bayonets for our carbines but so equipped the little carbine would be an easy maneuvered weapon, much better, to my way of thinking, than the Garand which is NOT easy to maneuver in close quarters. (Not detracting from the Garand's shooting ability but it is darned heavy and not quickly maneuvered.)
The Garand (without sling and bayonet) weighs plenty to carry around a lot like the allied troops did in WW II. Garand = 9.5 lbs My new rifle weighs 11.3 lbs empty. A bipod, scope, and a magazine of ammo adds a few pounds. It was not intended for off hand shooting but I can hold it steady long enough for a couple decent shots.
So you see, Egon, you probably had way more fire power in your collection than I had previously and could still do so. I'm just a little late getting a "real" rifle. The 6.5mm will humanely take deer at ranges likely to present a shot should I ever be so inclined. My plans for this rifle is to use it for longer range target shooting than is available with my other rifles. The 6.5 Creedmoor was developed for long range target shooting at ranges out to 1000 yards and more and can be used effectively as a varmint control tool.
It remains to be seen if I can shoot longer distances well enough to make it fun/practical.
When you stop by on your camper based tour, I will set you up with it and let you try it out. It has very mild recoil. The butt plate is steel and I shoot it with only a T shirt on and it is totally comfortable. I have 120 and 140 grain bullets. The lighter achieves a bit over 3000 ft per second and the 140 is just under. Good sectional density, nice aerodynamics, pretty flat trajectory, and less wind drift than the .308 has.
Pat
"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"
Actually there is one gun that I would like to have. A Ruger Mini 14 in a caliber larger than the original .223. Think it's the 6.8mm Remington that I would like. No scope though. [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img] Well maybe?? [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]
Egon [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]
Egon, I have often admired the Mini 14 and could have bought one at any time but I just never got around to it. There was something to be said for the .223 and that was easy cheap ammo availability but now it is a bit short in supply, I am told, due to ongoing military consumption.
The .338 is definitely a deer/elk/moose stopper (will take the wind out of the typical anti-social persons sails too.)
Unless you are just supremely blessed with slow aging eyes you would do better with optical sights, even if only a no magnification reflex sight that is like the HUD on a fighter aircraft.
Gone forever are the days when I could do really well with iron sights. I have a set of rings that have oval supports under the scope. If you reposition your "cheek weld" you can look through the rings and use the iron sights. When I got that scope and those rings I could actually do OK with the iron sights but now they are more of a curiosity except if a shot is presented at such close range as to make the scope useless. Partially blurry iron sights are better than a totally blurry scope because the target is way too close.
Pat
"I'm not from your planet, monkey boy!"
Well, I would actually prefer one in the .223 but that is not a legal hunting cartridge here.
Distances are short and maybe much brush so a scope could be in the way. If a scope is required there is a .243 or a .303 available. [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]
But in any case there is no desire to make holes in Bambi to start a lot of work.
Egon [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]
[img]/forums/images/icons/tongue.gif[/img] Jeepchick is retired from the Caif Dept of Corrections, and their std weapon is a Ruger Mini 14. We had always intended to buy one but never did. Jeepchick is a good shot, and could consistently score well over her minimum requirement in the quarterly qualification shoots. There has always been kind of a controversy regarding the Mini 14 vs the AR-15 rifles. Each gun has it's pluses and minuses, but I personally prefer the Ruger. We were close friends with one of the CDC armorers who mentioned that of the two guns, parts for the Ruger were much more difficult to obtain. [img]/forums/images/icons/tongue.gif[/img]
CJDave
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